Scan social media, comments on sites that still allow them, new media platforms like livestreaming services, and what becomes clear is that support for Israel in the United States is shifting.
Normiecons my age and older, I am early 50s Gen X, are still mostly feverish in their support of Israel but younger conservatives are definitely not and the younger you get, the less support for Our Greatest Ally. This might be the result of the long lamented decline of Christian religious observance as most Boomers/GenX types developed their devotion to Israel from the pulpit where dispensational teaching, even if not using that name, dominate theological discussions.
That's because the younger you are, the less impact 1979, 1983 or 1988 have on you and the more the events of 1991 and especially the events of 2001-2024 have on you that determine your opinions on Bagel Land vis a vis the Muslim world. I think it is less a result of religion or lack thereof and more politics and war in that cursed land being a constant festering sore since 1948.
The only fervent support I see is among boomers, especially evangelicals (but know a couple of Catholic boomers that want to "glass Gaza" because they watch Fox all the time). Gen Xers seem mostly indifferent, Millenials I know mildly critical (they definitely don't like The Lobby), and zoomers pretty hostile.
Also, it was common during the Bush years to see evangelicals fly Israel flags. You never see that now, at least not around here. So even younger evangelicals are cooling on our greatest ally.
What is it based on? Memories of 1979-1980 (most Gen Xers would have been pretty young then, even little kids or babies in some cases)? Just watching too much Fox and Newsmax and Daily Wire?
With Boomers it's more understandable, since their fathers were typically of the WW2 generation and they had the WW2 narrative pounded into them from birth.
Isreal is it's own worst enemy.. many jews know this.
Yes they currently have a lock on the US. But as Z points out it is slipping away. Just a short few months ago they were openly attempting to "build bridges" with BRICS. I suspect most of these countries have heard of the Trojan horse & have no evangelicals to open the gate.
You could not have war with Iran with Kamala or Biden in the White House becuse white men will not sign up to fight in a military full of trannies and freaks. Obviously Trump was allowed to win (the vote fraud machine was mysteriously stood down in 2024 after working overtime in 2018, 2020, and 2022). Also why the "woke" stuff is being dialed down for now.
If war with Iran comes, there will be a draft and the white men won't have a choice. And the jew boys will get medical and other deferments, as always.
Of course. Still much easier for a Republican to sell war for Israel to their base, a lot of whom are these crazed Scofield-bible, Israel-worshiping evangelicals. These people would balk at fighting under a Kamala or a Biden. Dems can really only do color revolutions, proxy wars and limited bombing campaigns with few US boots on the ground.
My understanding is that Iran's (civilian) nuclear program is spread out at many sites throughout the Zagros
mountains and elsewhere, not at all an easy target, and no guarantee of intended effect "IF" US/Israeli aircraft can even get near it.
Kursk nuclear power plant has two reactors shut down as part of the process to replace all four RMBK reactors with new models at Kursk II plant...Zaphirozia NPP has been shut down for years.
Israel has the stupidest enemies. They dispossess the Arabs, locking some of them into the Gaza Strip. Rather than moving on they throw support to crazy jihadis who vow to push the Jews into the sea (never going to happen). And they waste time making rockets to fire over their prison walls. Every “aktion” the jihadis take only gives Israel an excuse to screw the Arabs over more. Plus they get to be used as pawns by other regional powers.
The jews of Israel will never stop making war on their non-jewish neighbors. History has shown that once the jews have weapons, they turn them on their neighbors in the most savage manner imaginable. This behavior is recorded in the Old Testament and nothing about them has changed in two thousand years. They're a people struct in amber in the desert of the Sinai pennisula forever.
Lol. They r survivors. Their neighbors are barbaric head choppers whose culture/religion demand total submission. They prevail in a region where Christians n other minorities have either been driven out or made extinct. In general Jews r willing to relocate and learn the rules of where ever they set up shop and use them to their advantage. They have certainly made big contributions to the U.S. I have nothing but respect for them, although I realize their interests often don’t align with mine.
Islam is just 'judaism for arabs'. There's no perversion or act of violence in the Koran that isn't presaged in the Tanakh or the Talmud.
I respect them as an enemy, nothing more. I learn from them because they have created a very effective racial supremacist/racial nepotist network that deserves study and application to the interests of Whites.
Blaming the behavior of the jews on anyone other than the jews is exactly how the jews like things. But it's a lie. The jews inserted themselves into Palestine via terrorism and espionage. There's a criminal people who created a criminal state.
As for the jews 'willingness' to 'relocate' and use local rules to their advantage, this is true. But you appear to be accepting this behavior, whereas I do not. The jews are people who take advantage of other people. They're parasites. Even their racially supremacist national socialist Israel depends upon siphoning money from other countries in the form of 'foreign aid' and 'holocaust reparations'.
Oh please, you make Jews sound like some sort of super human beings They are not alone in watching out for their own interests. I know for a fact that many Eastern Europeans living in the U.S. actively lobbied for NATO expansion. The Baltic countries are mad crazy to have the U.S. fight Russia for them. Many different groups in the U.S. place there own interests above mine. Wang Li wrote a book America against America about how the U.S. will eventually collapse due to myriad competing interests while lacking a unified vision.
As for Israel there is something like half a billion Arabs in the Middle East, but unlike the Jews and the western countries they can’t get their act together to accomplish anything. If you feel so bad about the Arabs, invite them to live in your neighborhood.
I never claimed the jews were 'super human beings', that's your language. And I'm not sure what you're arguing here. You're admitting that jews look after their own interests. As for the 'Arabs', when have they been given a moment's peace in the last century? Whenever a leader comes forward with something like a vision for unifying their (often religiously disparate) countries, the jews operating through their US or UK proxies murder them.
As for inviting Arabs into my neighborhood, I don't want jews or Arabs in my neighborhood.
I can’t believe I waste any brain cells talking to you, you sound like a follower of Lois Farrakhan. He is popular among a certain demographic for whom blame of others and victimhood defines them. Raised Eastern Orthodox my falling out from the global American empire occurred when they decided to take the side of Catholic Croat, Moslem Bosnians (Turks), and Moslem Albanians against the Orthodox Serbs in the Balkan wars. As an aside the only world leader to express reservations was the Israel PM who didn’t like the meddling in the region against the only ethnic group that fought the Nazis and tried to shelter Jews.
Also, as the above example shows, good luck trying to form some sort of community or culture based on skin color. One of the defining characteristics of Europeans is their tendency to self separate and maintain ther own language and traditions. Even little countries have there own history and traditions that go back centuries. Compare that with how Arabic is spoken by many separate groups. Here in the U.S. a good portion of the country can only trace there history here at most a century. The other defining European characteristic is openness to new ideas and the ability to incorporate them. Jews were able to move around and when useful were able to prosper. They have contributed much to the U.S. As far as parasitism there is plenty of that without them.
History shows the reason for Jewish success. They have a shared history that goes back millennia which they actively celebrate as part of their religion. They have strong families, strong tribal loyalties, and extreme flexibility, always looking for new opportunities and new fields that they can break into and dominate like nuclear physics, new forms of entertainment and IT. They r not tied to the land and can more easily flee or move to where the opportunity is. Not being tied to the land is probably why Israel is important to them as a possible last refuge.
It is crazy that u would try to imitate that in any way. I know lots of Jews and generally they get along with everyone. I also know they r separate and most have a low opinion of non-Jews so don’t bother to send me your poor white boy woe is me bullshit.
Funny thing, Iran recently demonstrated their ability to drop hypersonic missiles on Israel with impunity, completely negating all it's US and domestic defenses including Patruot, David's Sling, and Iron Dome.
It would be quite simple to redirect those missiles to Dimona and irradiate swaths of Israel for centuries...Iran can easily withstand multiple nuclear strikes, Israel would be demolished as a nation with one blow.
The mistake Iran made was not dropping them on real targets right from the jump. Making a mere demonstration of what they can do with their missiles was perceived as a sign of weakness by the Israelis.
Without nuclear warheads these missiles r of zero strategic value. German V2 rockets were unstoppable n they fired hundreds of them. But they made no difference in the outcome of the war.
Of course nukes r another story, which is why Iran will never be allowed to have them.
Couldn’t you just type out the full words “are” and “and” instead of “r” and “n?” You typed out all the other words. It really takes away from your strategic military genius.
Ok, ok pretty funny. I am just old AND have seen it all before. I can remember when the Hayden Planetarium had a cut away of a Viking rocket the navy made by copying the v-2. The accompanying text stated that it was determined (in 1948) that such rockets were not suitable for carrying nuclear weapons which were at that time large and heavy. The U.S. concentrated on Aviation instead. Knowing they could not compete in the field of Aviation the Communists poured all kinds of resources into building massive rockets. That lead to the “missile gap” and Russias early successes in the “space race”.
What was true in 1948 (which I probably read about as a kid in 1962) is true today AND doesnt take a genius to figure out.
Hypersonics with conventional warheads can devastate Israeli POL and ammunition stockpiles, easily..and again, can strike Dimona and scatter radioactive debris far and wide, possibly even a meltdown. For a speck of a nation like Israel, that is a big fat, hairy deal.
Hypersonic blah, blah. When I saw Russian hypersonic used early in Ukraine I knew Russia had big problems in the war. They r useless without a nuclear warhead. It makes no sense to send a missile costing many millions to deliver at most a few thousand pound (probably less) conventional payload. In comparison a single WW2 B-17 could carry up to (depending on desired range) 4000-17000 lbs. That’s why they have pretty much switched to cheap expendable drones.
I often think of Israel’s position as similar to Rhodesia’s. They had the best military did excellent counter insurgency and took big steps to integrate the local natives. But they were surrounded by hostile states that could keep an insurgency alive for ever. The Israelis r smart, they moved locals onto refugee “reservations” and either made sure border states friendly dictatorships or failed states.
The Ukraine war was not only about the long standing hatred for Russia but by weakening Russia the Assad rage was toppled eliminating the land bridge between Iran and Shite militias. Those militias defeated Israel before and were a WAY bigger threat than hypersonic missiles.
The use of hypersonic missiles against Ukraine were not intended to be tactically very useful. Rather it was a warning sign to NATO that the Russians had a weapon that NATO—rather the US—had no defense from. It was bold move for Putin to put the first test of this weapon in the Ukrainian battle field. The range of this weapon is much longer than its initial use. All NATO capitals can be reached as well as American battle groups in the Mediterranean. After the first use by Putin, he was seen at any number of events lecturing/bragging to folk (really NATO) about this new weapon and it meaning in the new arms race the US had initiated under Trump 1 when the US pulled out of such treaties. Even Z-man a year or so ago scoffed at the notion that a hypersonic glide weapon was anywhere near rollout technologically.
Yes, in the context of a limited nuclear war involving only small tactical nukes they would be very useful. It makes sense for the Russians since they have the largest arsenal of tactical nuclear weapons.
I don’t want to get into a discussion on types of vehicles, comparing rocket propelled versus air breathers the U.S. is trying to build but in either case it is simple engineering. You make things go fast by making them lighter. So payload not nuclear is not tactically significant. Also I thought some of the propaganda successes mentioned such as hitting hotels was done with Iskander ballistic missiles not hypersonics.
Blah, blah, indeed! Do you have anything relevant to my point that Iran can easily strike Dimona and irradiate tiny Israel, rendering much of it uninhabitable?
And, by the way, Russian hypersonics have been greatly effective at taking out Ukraine's NASM, Iris T and Patriot batteries...not to mention hotels full of NATO mercenaries and advisors, as in Odessa just days ago. Not quite as "useless" as you imagine, and seemingly more effective than ATACMS this far in the conflict.
My understanding is that site is underground and no doubt would require a direct hit with some sort of massive bunker buster bomb to penetrate the shielding. Also, your premise assumes the reactor used to produce fissile material is or has been recently on line to have the most lethal radioactive material. When I worked as a tech at a nuclear plant we could go into containment a couple of weeks after it was shut down. The Russians have shut down their big nuke plant in Ukraine to forestall any such disaster if struck. The actual bombs may not even be there and won’t explode as a result of impact or fire and the residue can be cleaned up which proper chemical treatments.
Of course this would unleash a firestorm on Iran so this is all academic anyway. The Israeli strategy of hitting back many times harder when struck is an old one and an effective one.
I am not even going to say anything on the Ukraine war as it will unleash a shit storm of replies.
Normiecons my age and older, I am early 50s Gen X, are still mostly feverish in their support of Israel but younger conservatives are definitely not and the younger you get, the less support for Our Greatest Ally. This might be the result of the long lamented decline of Christian religious observance as most Boomers/GenX types developed their devotion to Israel from the pulpit where dispensational teaching, even if not using that name, dominate theological discussions.
That's because the younger you are, the less impact 1979, 1983 or 1988 have on you and the more the events of 1991 and especially the events of 2001-2024 have on you that determine your opinions on Bagel Land vis a vis the Muslim world. I think it is less a result of religion or lack thereof and more politics and war in that cursed land being a constant festering sore since 1948.
The only fervent support I see is among boomers, especially evangelicals (but know a couple of Catholic boomers that want to "glass Gaza" because they watch Fox all the time). Gen Xers seem mostly indifferent, Millenials I know mildly critical (they definitely don't like The Lobby), and zoomers pretty hostile.
Also, it was common during the Bush years to see evangelicals fly Israel flags. You never see that now, at least not around here. So even younger evangelicals are cooling on our greatest ally.
Agreed. I'm a mid-50s Gen Xer, and am astounded at the uncritical support for Israel amongst our cohort, Christian, and non-Christian.
What is it based on? Memories of 1979-1980 (most Gen Xers would have been pretty young then, even little kids or babies in some cases)? Just watching too much Fox and Newsmax and Daily Wire?
With Boomers it's more understandable, since their fathers were typically of the WW2 generation and they had the WW2 narrative pounded into them from birth.
I know, right! My evidence is anecdotal.
Isreal is it's own worst enemy.. many jews know this.
Yes they currently have a lock on the US. But as Z points out it is slipping away. Just a short few months ago they were openly attempting to "build bridges" with BRICS. I suspect most of these countries have heard of the Trojan horse & have no evangelicals to open the gate.
Israel lost my support on June 8, 1967.
Miriam Adelson supported Trump and kept him out of jail by helping him win. That’s the entire story.
And Miriam Adelson is just a spokesperson for Netanyahu.
You could not have war with Iran with Kamala or Biden in the White House becuse white men will not sign up to fight in a military full of trannies and freaks. Obviously Trump was allowed to win (the vote fraud machine was mysteriously stood down in 2024 after working overtime in 2018, 2020, and 2022). Also why the "woke" stuff is being dialed down for now.
If war with Iran comes, there will be a draft and the white men won't have a choice. And the jew boys will get medical and other deferments, as always.
Of course. Still much easier for a Republican to sell war for Israel to their base, a lot of whom are these crazed Scofield-bible, Israel-worshiping evangelicals. These people would balk at fighting under a Kamala or a Biden. Dems can really only do color revolutions, proxy wars and limited bombing campaigns with few US boots on the ground.
My understanding is that Iran's (civilian) nuclear program is spread out at many sites throughout the Zagros
mountains and elsewhere, not at all an easy target, and no guarantee of intended effect "IF" US/Israeli aircraft can even get near it.
Kursk nuclear power plant has two reactors shut down as part of the process to replace all four RMBK reactors with new models at Kursk II plant...Zaphirozia NPP has been shut down for years.
Between your lips and God's ears.
Z man have you read Caitlin Johnstone's retarded shitlib cri de coeur about how she envies the Palestinians? Everyone should read it
Frequently wrong, indeed 🤣
Israel has the stupidest enemies. They dispossess the Arabs, locking some of them into the Gaza Strip. Rather than moving on they throw support to crazy jihadis who vow to push the Jews into the sea (never going to happen). And they waste time making rockets to fire over their prison walls. Every “aktion” the jihadis take only gives Israel an excuse to screw the Arabs over more. Plus they get to be used as pawns by other regional powers.
The jews of Israel will never stop making war on their non-jewish neighbors. History has shown that once the jews have weapons, they turn them on their neighbors in the most savage manner imaginable. This behavior is recorded in the Old Testament and nothing about them has changed in two thousand years. They're a people struct in amber in the desert of the Sinai pennisula forever.
Lol. They r survivors. Their neighbors are barbaric head choppers whose culture/religion demand total submission. They prevail in a region where Christians n other minorities have either been driven out or made extinct. In general Jews r willing to relocate and learn the rules of where ever they set up shop and use them to their advantage. They have certainly made big contributions to the U.S. I have nothing but respect for them, although I realize their interests often don’t align with mine.
Islam is just 'judaism for arabs'. There's no perversion or act of violence in the Koran that isn't presaged in the Tanakh or the Talmud.
I respect them as an enemy, nothing more. I learn from them because they have created a very effective racial supremacist/racial nepotist network that deserves study and application to the interests of Whites.
Blaming the behavior of the jews on anyone other than the jews is exactly how the jews like things. But it's a lie. The jews inserted themselves into Palestine via terrorism and espionage. There's a criminal people who created a criminal state.
As for the jews 'willingness' to 'relocate' and use local rules to their advantage, this is true. But you appear to be accepting this behavior, whereas I do not. The jews are people who take advantage of other people. They're parasites. Even their racially supremacist national socialist Israel depends upon siphoning money from other countries in the form of 'foreign aid' and 'holocaust reparations'.
They are not a people to be admired.
Oh please, you make Jews sound like some sort of super human beings They are not alone in watching out for their own interests. I know for a fact that many Eastern Europeans living in the U.S. actively lobbied for NATO expansion. The Baltic countries are mad crazy to have the U.S. fight Russia for them. Many different groups in the U.S. place there own interests above mine. Wang Li wrote a book America against America about how the U.S. will eventually collapse due to myriad competing interests while lacking a unified vision.
As for Israel there is something like half a billion Arabs in the Middle East, but unlike the Jews and the western countries they can’t get their act together to accomplish anything. If you feel so bad about the Arabs, invite them to live in your neighborhood.
I never claimed the jews were 'super human beings', that's your language. And I'm not sure what you're arguing here. You're admitting that jews look after their own interests. As for the 'Arabs', when have they been given a moment's peace in the last century? Whenever a leader comes forward with something like a vision for unifying their (often religiously disparate) countries, the jews operating through their US or UK proxies murder them.
As for inviting Arabs into my neighborhood, I don't want jews or Arabs in my neighborhood.
Are you a jew?
I can’t believe I waste any brain cells talking to you, you sound like a follower of Lois Farrakhan. He is popular among a certain demographic for whom blame of others and victimhood defines them. Raised Eastern Orthodox my falling out from the global American empire occurred when they decided to take the side of Catholic Croat, Moslem Bosnians (Turks), and Moslem Albanians against the Orthodox Serbs in the Balkan wars. As an aside the only world leader to express reservations was the Israel PM who didn’t like the meddling in the region against the only ethnic group that fought the Nazis and tried to shelter Jews.
Also, as the above example shows, good luck trying to form some sort of community or culture based on skin color. One of the defining characteristics of Europeans is their tendency to self separate and maintain ther own language and traditions. Even little countries have there own history and traditions that go back centuries. Compare that with how Arabic is spoken by many separate groups. Here in the U.S. a good portion of the country can only trace there history here at most a century. The other defining European characteristic is openness to new ideas and the ability to incorporate them. Jews were able to move around and when useful were able to prosper. They have contributed much to the U.S. As far as parasitism there is plenty of that without them.
History shows the reason for Jewish success. They have a shared history that goes back millennia which they actively celebrate as part of their religion. They have strong families, strong tribal loyalties, and extreme flexibility, always looking for new opportunities and new fields that they can break into and dominate like nuclear physics, new forms of entertainment and IT. They r not tied to the land and can more easily flee or move to where the opportunity is. Not being tied to the land is probably why Israel is important to them as a possible last refuge.
It is crazy that u would try to imitate that in any way. I know lots of Jews and generally they get along with everyone. I also know they r separate and most have a low opinion of non-Jews so don’t bother to send me your poor white boy woe is me bullshit.
Anyway, the Chinese are going to own the future.
Funny thing, Iran recently demonstrated their ability to drop hypersonic missiles on Israel with impunity, completely negating all it's US and domestic defenses including Patruot, David's Sling, and Iron Dome.
It would be quite simple to redirect those missiles to Dimona and irradiate swaths of Israel for centuries...Iran can easily withstand multiple nuclear strikes, Israel would be demolished as a nation with one blow.
The mistake Iran made was not dropping them on real targets right from the jump. Making a mere demonstration of what they can do with their missiles was perceived as a sign of weakness by the Israelis.
Without nuclear warheads these missiles r of zero strategic value. German V2 rockets were unstoppable n they fired hundreds of them. But they made no difference in the outcome of the war.
Of course nukes r another story, which is why Iran will never be allowed to have them.
Couldn’t you just type out the full words “are” and “and” instead of “r” and “n?” You typed out all the other words. It really takes away from your strategic military genius.
Ok, ok pretty funny. I am just old AND have seen it all before. I can remember when the Hayden Planetarium had a cut away of a Viking rocket the navy made by copying the v-2. The accompanying text stated that it was determined (in 1948) that such rockets were not suitable for carrying nuclear weapons which were at that time large and heavy. The U.S. concentrated on Aviation instead. Knowing they could not compete in the field of Aviation the Communists poured all kinds of resources into building massive rockets. That lead to the “missile gap” and Russias early successes in the “space race”.
What was true in 1948 (which I probably read about as a kid in 1962) is true today AND doesnt take a genius to figure out.
Hypersonics with conventional warheads can devastate Israeli POL and ammunition stockpiles, easily..and again, can strike Dimona and scatter radioactive debris far and wide, possibly even a meltdown. For a speck of a nation like Israel, that is a big fat, hairy deal.
Hypersonic blah, blah. When I saw Russian hypersonic used early in Ukraine I knew Russia had big problems in the war. They r useless without a nuclear warhead. It makes no sense to send a missile costing many millions to deliver at most a few thousand pound (probably less) conventional payload. In comparison a single WW2 B-17 could carry up to (depending on desired range) 4000-17000 lbs. That’s why they have pretty much switched to cheap expendable drones.
I often think of Israel’s position as similar to Rhodesia’s. They had the best military did excellent counter insurgency and took big steps to integrate the local natives. But they were surrounded by hostile states that could keep an insurgency alive for ever. The Israelis r smart, they moved locals onto refugee “reservations” and either made sure border states friendly dictatorships or failed states.
The Ukraine war was not only about the long standing hatred for Russia but by weakening Russia the Assad rage was toppled eliminating the land bridge between Iran and Shite militias. Those militias defeated Israel before and were a WAY bigger threat than hypersonic missiles.
The use of hypersonic missiles against Ukraine were not intended to be tactically very useful. Rather it was a warning sign to NATO that the Russians had a weapon that NATO—rather the US—had no defense from. It was bold move for Putin to put the first test of this weapon in the Ukrainian battle field. The range of this weapon is much longer than its initial use. All NATO capitals can be reached as well as American battle groups in the Mediterranean. After the first use by Putin, he was seen at any number of events lecturing/bragging to folk (really NATO) about this new weapon and it meaning in the new arms race the US had initiated under Trump 1 when the US pulled out of such treaties. Even Z-man a year or so ago scoffed at the notion that a hypersonic glide weapon was anywhere near rollout technologically.
Yes, in the context of a limited nuclear war involving only small tactical nukes they would be very useful. It makes sense for the Russians since they have the largest arsenal of tactical nuclear weapons.
I don’t want to get into a discussion on types of vehicles, comparing rocket propelled versus air breathers the U.S. is trying to build but in either case it is simple engineering. You make things go fast by making them lighter. So payload not nuclear is not tactically significant. Also I thought some of the propaganda successes mentioned such as hitting hotels was done with Iskander ballistic missiles not hypersonics.
Blah, blah, indeed! Do you have anything relevant to my point that Iran can easily strike Dimona and irradiate tiny Israel, rendering much of it uninhabitable?
And, by the way, Russian hypersonics have been greatly effective at taking out Ukraine's NASM, Iris T and Patriot batteries...not to mention hotels full of NATO mercenaries and advisors, as in Odessa just days ago. Not quite as "useless" as you imagine, and seemingly more effective than ATACMS this far in the conflict.
My understanding is that site is underground and no doubt would require a direct hit with some sort of massive bunker buster bomb to penetrate the shielding. Also, your premise assumes the reactor used to produce fissile material is or has been recently on line to have the most lethal radioactive material. When I worked as a tech at a nuclear plant we could go into containment a couple of weeks after it was shut down. The Russians have shut down their big nuke plant in Ukraine to forestall any such disaster if struck. The actual bombs may not even be there and won’t explode as a result of impact or fire and the residue can be cleaned up which proper chemical treatments.
Of course this would unleash a firestorm on Iran so this is all academic anyway. The Israeli strategy of hitting back many times harder when struck is an old one and an effective one.
I am not even going to say anything on the Ukraine war as it will unleash a shit storm of replies.