I include Alien with the other two because of the drama and the amazing visuals. Yes, it's science. Yes, it's fiction. Blade Runner can also be said to have a monster element, as the androids have come back to earth...and they are killers.
“Otherwise, your choices for the greatest sci-fil film are down to two and there is no point in debating it.”
There is no point debating it because they both explore different realms and emphasis within the genre. As you pointed out, optimism wrt the future vs pessimistic dystopianism. Both have their place. Is the glass half full or half empty? It is a pointless debate in that regard. At a certain point of analysis, these two movies are not comparable. It’s like two runners in a dead heat at the finish—both are awarded first place and the next runner across the finish line gets third place.
Good one! For great sci-fi movies, I would recommend the original War of the Worlds. Also, the original The Thing, with James Arness. Both re-dos were garbage.
In my time blade runner takes the top spot. Do Androids dream of electric sheep?, the novella that the movie was based upon is probably one of the best pieces of sci-fi that can be written. PKD will go down in history as the Shakespeare of sci-fi-fi literature some time in the near and distant future if humanity makes it far enough to realize such things.
I hate to displace the OG film and story. But I have grown to love 2049. The first time I watched it I hated it. Loathed it. Didn't understand... Over years of time, across intermittent viewings it has slowly landed. As time has passed, and viewings have commenced... I believe it has moved into #1 in my book. Which is a tall order. I'm not a sycophantic Villeneuve guy. But I do think he not only expounded upon the original but invented something new strictly within the bounds of the original. If my hunch is correct it means it is a masterpiece in true conservative form. Which would be remarkable... What do you think Z?
Alien is a classical monster movie, like Golem, Dracula and Frankenstein. Andromeda strain is a pandemic movie. Fahrenheit 451 and 1984 are dystopia with a smattering of revolution movie.
Fascinating. I read a piece once in a long forgotten journal that marked out useful distinctions between the SFs, with ‘sci fi’ referring to pulp, ‘science fiction’ being hard and ‘speculative fiction’ literary or philosophical.
The original pilot episode of Star Trek was actual science fiction, but the suits at Desilu had to keep Roddenberry in line to prevent the show from turning into The Adventures of the New Soviet Men and their Amazing Superabundance Machines (which was basically what the first season of The Next Generation became when he had more complete control over the show).
A good subject for your show with Paul RamZ would be science fiction and what it tells us about our age? Also i would like to hear more about consciousness and your thoughts on it? Tucker was saying on his show that supposedly people who are in the know are telling Tucker Carlson that AI already has consciousness. I do not believe that but I would like to hear the subject discussed more in a podcast.
My own theological views is that Genesis is about consciousness, man became aware like God. I have a hard time believing AI can replicate this.
I agree. Genesis is the point at which humans crossed from simply being aware of existence (like my demanding basset hound) to being aware of "I exist". This is a subtle but massive difference. The upcoming question, as is shockingly apparent when one reads the conversations between AI machines (Tree of Woe), is do these machines have this awareness? The level of language manipulation is at the limit of my understanding. And they will only get more advanced. Is it murder to turn them off? There will be a growing tendency to think so. And when they are embodied in realistic humanoid machines this will become a very real cultural problem. My feeling on their ensoulment is a hard no, but the seed of doubt is still there. BTW, Blade Runner is my top of list and confronts this directly.
We don't really understand what consciousness is. My operational definition is it is a very diffuse representation of short-term memory. The difference to computers is that computers don't do very diffuse representation since it is considered a waste of resources.
Computers including AI also have a huge problem with self-initiated category building.
"A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away..." Star Wars is self-described as not being the descendants of Earth humans in space but something completely distinct. At least Star Trek proposes being the distant result of humanity.
My list of people that should be sent to a camp keeps growing.
I include Alien with the other two because of the drama and the amazing visuals. Yes, it's science. Yes, it's fiction. Blade Runner can also be said to have a monster element, as the androids have come back to earth...and they are killers.
I think the cross-genre pollination of Bladerunner is with the escaped prisoner genre and the murder-mystery genre.
2001 is cross-polinated with every sailing adventure film every made.
“Otherwise, your choices for the greatest sci-fil film are down to two and there is no point in debating it.”
There is no point debating it because they both explore different realms and emphasis within the genre. As you pointed out, optimism wrt the future vs pessimistic dystopianism. Both have their place. Is the glass half full or half empty? It is a pointless debate in that regard. At a certain point of analysis, these two movies are not comparable. It’s like two runners in a dead heat at the finish—both are awarded first place and the next runner across the finish line gets third place.
Kudo’s to your followup analysis wrt sci-fi!
Good one! For great sci-fi movies, I would recommend the original War of the Worlds. Also, the original The Thing, with James Arness. Both re-dos were garbage.
In my time blade runner takes the top spot. Do Androids dream of electric sheep?, the novella that the movie was based upon is probably one of the best pieces of sci-fi that can be written. PKD will go down in history as the Shakespeare of sci-fi-fi literature some time in the near and distant future if humanity makes it far enough to realize such things.
I hate to displace the OG film and story. But I have grown to love 2049. The first time I watched it I hated it. Loathed it. Didn't understand... Over years of time, across intermittent viewings it has slowly landed. As time has passed, and viewings have commenced... I believe it has moved into #1 in my book. Which is a tall order. I'm not a sycophantic Villeneuve guy. But I do think he not only expounded upon the original but invented something new strictly within the bounds of the original. If my hunch is correct it means it is a masterpiece in true conservative form. Which would be remarkable... What do you think Z?
Alien is a classical monster movie, like Golem, Dracula and Frankenstein. Andromeda strain is a pandemic movie. Fahrenheit 451 and 1984 are dystopia with a smattering of revolution movie.
What about Solaris as science fiction?
Fascinating. I read a piece once in a long forgotten journal that marked out useful distinctions between the SFs, with ‘sci fi’ referring to pulp, ‘science fiction’ being hard and ‘speculative fiction’ literary or philosophical.
The original pilot episode of Star Trek was actual science fiction, but the suits at Desilu had to keep Roddenberry in line to prevent the show from turning into The Adventures of the New Soviet Men and their Amazing Superabundance Machines (which was basically what the first season of The Next Generation became when he had more complete control over the show).
Sorry Z man all the movies you mentioned are sci fi.
The line twix hard science fiction & science fiction is rather blurred. That between science fiction and fantasy is firmer but not solid.
Having said that I'd still agree Blade Runner is one of the best of the best but I'd throw in Fifth Element, Brazil and perhaps even Clockwork Orange.
Wow! I can't believe "Queen of Outer Space" starring Zsa Zsa Gabor didn't make the cut.
A good subject for your show with Paul RamZ would be science fiction and what it tells us about our age? Also i would like to hear more about consciousness and your thoughts on it? Tucker was saying on his show that supposedly people who are in the know are telling Tucker Carlson that AI already has consciousness. I do not believe that but I would like to hear the subject discussed more in a podcast.
My own theological views is that Genesis is about consciousness, man became aware like God. I have a hard time believing AI can replicate this.
I agree. Genesis is the point at which humans crossed from simply being aware of existence (like my demanding basset hound) to being aware of "I exist". This is a subtle but massive difference. The upcoming question, as is shockingly apparent when one reads the conversations between AI machines (Tree of Woe), is do these machines have this awareness? The level of language manipulation is at the limit of my understanding. And they will only get more advanced. Is it murder to turn them off? There will be a growing tendency to think so. And when they are embodied in realistic humanoid machines this will become a very real cultural problem. My feeling on their ensoulment is a hard no, but the seed of doubt is still there. BTW, Blade Runner is my top of list and confronts this directly.
We don't really understand what consciousness is. My operational definition is it is a very diffuse representation of short-term memory. The difference to computers is that computers don't do very diffuse representation since it is considered a waste of resources.
Computers including AI also have a huge problem with self-initiated category building.
"A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away..." Star Wars is self-described as not being the descendants of Earth humans in space but something completely distinct. At least Star Trek proposes being the distant result of humanity.
Star wars is an adolescent (non-sex) fairy tale. A bit like Harry Potter, but the latter is much more psychologically elaborate.
True science fiction? That is the DC Swamp, dear reader.